Comments on: Let’s get with the program and abolish HMOs for good http://ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/ Editor and technology critic in the midst of founding a new web startup: gdgt. Thu, 12 Jan 2012 15:44:30 -0800 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: James http://ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-112922 James Tue, 14 Dec 2010 15:57:06 +0000 http://www.ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-112922 Look at CA, they have a system that works. People are dying left and right for what should have been preventive treatment. The key word is preventative. If we only treated a problem while it was caught early, millions of lives would be saved each year. I'm sorry, but the health care situation in the states is horrendous. The universal health care on military installations is universal with zero cost to men and women in the armed services. And guess what, it works! If it is working on the small communities on base, it will work nation wide. /end rant Look at CA, they have a system that works. People are dying left and right for what should have been preventive treatment. The key word is preventative. If we only treated a problem while it was caught early, millions of lives would be saved each year. I’m sorry, but the health care situation in the states is horrendous.

The universal health care on military installations is universal with zero cost to men and women in the armed services. And guess what, it works! If it is working on the small communities on base, it will work nation wide.

/end rant

]]> By: Gremlin http://ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55243 Gremlin Sat, 22 Dec 2007 08:20:31 +0000 http://www.ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55243 Gotta go with Ben D on this one. There is only so much health care to go around and most honest people would agree that for the people who can afford it, America offers some of the best health care in the world. We have top notch facilities, and our doctors need to be paid more - not less. Socializing medicine is not the answer as it would result in more private practice doctors going out of business and the total population's health care deteriorating. The current system could definitely use work though. Gotta go with Ben D on this one.

There is only so much health care to go around and most honest people would agree that for the people who can afford it, America offers some of the best health care in the world. We have top notch facilities, and our doctors need to be paid more – not less. Socializing medicine is not the answer as it would result in more private practice doctors going out of business and the total population’s health care deteriorating.

The current system could definitely use work though.

]]> By: Ben Drawbaugh http://ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55235 Ben Drawbaugh Sat, 22 Dec 2007 04:24:23 +0000 http://www.ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55235 I believe they still have socialized medicine in Russia and I'd bet you could still run Engadget from there. ;) Seriously, do you really think the gov't can do anything right? Why would you want to put your health in their hands? I believe they still have socialized medicine in Russia and I’d bet you could still run Engadget from there. ;)

Seriously, do you really think the gov’t can do anything right? Why would you want to put your health in their hands?

]]> By: arn http://ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55229 arn Sat, 22 Dec 2007 03:28:17 +0000 http://www.ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55229 Hi Ryan, I'm a physician and wanted to make a few comments on this case. I don't know anything about it besides reading the article you linked. 1) You really think she would have gotten a liver transplant in a country with socialized medicine? I don't think so. Socialized medicine still has to ration resources. There are only so many livers available at a given time 2) "vegetative state for weeks" - I know this is a lay-article... but that's typically suggests brain damage/death, though if she was being seriously considered, it seems unlikely that it was brain death. 3) 6 month survival of 65-percent sounds crazy high, that quote may have been in a person who was otherwise "healthy". But in a bone marrow transplant patient in a persistant vegitative state? I'd guess the survival rate was much lower. And that is the crux of the decision. X amount of people pay the HMO, or X amount of money is raised by the country for socialized medicine. A liver transplant would be hundreds of thousands of dollars. If her survival was 0%, should she get the liver? If it was 5%, should she get the liver? If it was 50% should she get the liver? If it's 50%, should she get the liver over someone who has a 90% chance. That "liver" that they would have transplanted in her would have been "taken" from someone else on the waiting list. Hi Ryan,

I’m a physician and wanted to make a few comments on this case. I don’t know anything about it besides reading the article you linked.

1) You really think she would have gotten a liver transplant in a country with socialized medicine? I don’t think so. Socialized medicine still has to ration resources. There are only so many livers available at a given time

2) “vegetative state for weeks” – I know this is a lay-article… but that’s typically suggests brain damage/death, though if she was being seriously
considered, it seems unlikely that it was brain death.

3) 6 month survival of 65-percent sounds crazy high, that quote may have been in a person who was otherwise “healthy”. But in a bone marrow transplant patient in a persistant vegitative state? I’d guess the survival rate was much lower.

And that is the crux of the decision. X amount of people pay the HMO, or X amount of money is raised by the country for socialized medicine. A liver transplant would be hundreds of thousands of dollars. If her survival was 0%, should she get the liver? If it was 5%, should she get the liver? If it was 50% should she get the liver?

If it’s 50%, should she get the liver over someone who has a 90% chance. That “liver” that they would have transplanted in her would have been “taken” from someone else on the waiting list.

]]> By: peteremcc http://ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55227 peteremcc Sat, 22 Dec 2007 02:19:01 +0000 http://www.ryanblock.com/2007/12/lets-get-with-the-program-and-abolish-hmos-for-good/#comment-55227 Sorry, but it happens here in New Zealand where we (unfortunately) have socialised heathcare. Patients can't get access to medicine because it costs too much for the district health boards to pay for, huge waiting lists for surgery (and the governments solution is to create waiting lists to get on the waiting list to make it look like they are shorter) and a lack of specialists and beds while private hospitals have plenty of spare room. Just check out a selection of news stories from my local hospital, just from the last couple of weeks: http://www.hbtoday.co.nz/localnews/storydisplay.cfm?thesection=localnews&storyid=3757796 http://www.stuff.co.nz/4332971a20475.html http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/536641/1507894 http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/1318360/1509200 Private is always more effective and efficient than public, simply because the government is useless at running stuff. What the US lacks - and what the government, both in NZ and the US, SHOULD be doing - is making sure that everyone has access to that more effective and efficient private healthcare. The grass isn't always greener on the other side... Sorry, but it happens here in New Zealand where we (unfortunately) have socialised heathcare.

Patients can’t get access to medicine because it costs too much for the district health boards to pay for, huge waiting lists for surgery (and the governments solution is to create waiting lists to get on the waiting list to make it look like they are shorter) and a lack of specialists and beds while private hospitals have plenty of spare room.

Just check out a selection of news stories from my local hospital, just from the last couple of weeks:

http://www.hbtoday.co.nz/localnews/storydisplay.cfm?thesection=localnews&storyid=3757796
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4332971a20475.html
http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/536641/1507894
http://tvnz.co.nz/view/page/1318360/1509200

Private is always more effective and efficient than public, simply because the government is useless at running stuff. What the US lacks – and what the government, both in NZ and the US, SHOULD be doing – is making sure that everyone has access to that more effective and efficient private healthcare.

The grass isn’t always greener on the other side…

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